ESP or Oneill Bros?

[mynameismud76]

Hi guys,

Just doing some research, but I can't appreciate the difference between ESP engines and Oneill Bros ones. Are there other ones I can look at also?

Having seen footages of these two engines, but as they were mounted to different kits, comparison was difficult to gauge. ESP seems more powerful, but somebody has cracked the cylinder housing after 3 tanks. And the Oneill Bros engine is equally powerful, but power seems to be more useable.

I've dropped a LRP into my Nitro truck and chewed up the drive train with all that extra power. Are there things I'd need to do to the current (stock) drivetrain in preparation for the new power increase?

[mooman007uk]

OBR all the way for me, Sean's porting is more aggressive in comparable tunes from what i've seen side by side, and his full mod motors make gobs of useable power for a good price. i'm running OBR 27.2 full mod and vrc pro and haven't had to do anything to beef up the drive train, i ran the latest inner diff case version for about 5 tanks and they held up fine...i've switched to alloy cases now but don't feel it's an essential upgrade...just personal choice.
Merlin is running a stock punisher with OBR 30.5 full mod and hasn't posted any problems as yet either

[mynameismud76]

Was pretty set on ESP's till I saw this:

http://www.msuk-forum.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=80054

Now I think I'll go Oneills way. Seen Merlin's power plant, very impressive, like how it picks up the front end!! :punk:

[Clubin]

Was pretty set on ESP's till I saw this:

http://www.msuk-forum.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=80054

Now I think I'll go Oneills way. Seen Merlin's power plant, very impressive, like how it picks up the front end!! :punk:
Don't let that alarm you, these cylinders are all made by either CY or Zenoah. And ESP and ONB just port them. Somthing happened tio that cylinder, eithr a twisted crank, or a big crash.

I am a fan of O'Neill Brothers, I have a 2 bolt ported and machined 27.2, a 4 bolt 27.2 full mod, and I have a 28.5cc 4 bolt full mod coming, Sean has been a great help to me in the past. THat is why my loyalty is with him. I like how he ships stuff to Canada too, it never costs me any taxes or duty. LOL

Thing about ONB is you need to order direct. THere are a few places around that sell ONB, but not many. I know Scott from Vancouver hobbies stocks some ONB stuff.

Go with ONB, and buy with confidence.

[pwaicon]

I wouldn’t shy away from an ESP engine just because of those pictures; it’s the CY head that failed. I bought a race ported top end kit from Oneill Bros and the same thing happened to me on my first outing. Oneill Bros replaced it for me without any hassles at all, great customer service in my book. I haven’t had any issues with any of the ESP engines I have, so far they have proven to be reliable and make great power. I think they both do excellent work it all comes down to personal choice.

1041104210431044

[Merlin]

Again, another vote for O'Neil bros. Exellent customer service, and theres no question that there motors can perform. Very happy with mine indeed. I would certainly go back for another :)

[mynameismud76]

Cheers guys for input. The owner of that cracked ESP says the car's not been in a crash to do that sort of damage, which puzzles him even more as to why it happened. =)


Clubin. What's the difference between 2 and 4 bolt?

Pwaicon. That's mad cylinder damage. How did it happen?

Merlin. How's your drivetrain handling all that extra ooomph? (just found my stock 23cc engine has chewed my rear diff gears..see Finally!! Woohoo!! thread)

[mynameismud76]

Don't let that alarm you, these cylinders are all made by either CY or Zenoah. And ESP and ONB just port them. Somthing happened tio that cylinder, eithr a twisted crank, or a big crash.

I am a fan of O'Neill Brothers, I have a 2 bolt ported and machined 27.2, a 4 bolt 27.2 full mod, and I have a 28.5cc 4 bolt full mod coming, Sean has been a great help to me in the past. THat is why my loyalty is with him. I like how he ships stuff to Canada too, it never costs me any taxes or duty. LOL

Thing about ONB is you need to order direct. THere are a few places around that sell ONB, but not many. I know Scott from Vancouver hobbies stocks some ONB stuff.

Go with ONB, and buy with confidence.


I wouldn’t shy away from an ESP engine just because of those pictures; it’s the CY head that failed. I bought a race ported top end kit from Oneill Bros and the same thing happened to me on my first outing. Oneill Bros replaced it for me without any hassles at all, great customer service in my book. I haven’t had any issues with any of the ESP engines I have, so far they have proven to be reliable and make great power. I think they both do excellent work it all comes down to personal choice.

1041104210431044


Again, another vote for O'Neil bros. Exellent customer service, and theres no question that there motors can perform. Very happy with mine indeed. I would certainly go back for another :)




What size do I go for?

I understand how smaller engines revs higher and larger engines have more grunt down low.

Would having a higher gearing ratio on a larger (30cc) engine give the similar top end?

[Pipeous]

I go ONB. Both are great builders, but ONB has never come on a forum to bash another modder... can't say that about ESP... we also have a forum member here that does engines you can consider. TMR has been doing dyno stuff. I am all for keeping it in the family so to speak. He explains stuff well and has the knowledge. I don't know what his engines are like but you can tell a lot about a person in how they explain stuff.

[mynameismud76]

I thought I was undecided, but now I'm not so sure..:going insane:

Yup, shall give TMR a shout. Cheers =)

[Clubin]

Mud, the 4 bolt has 4 bolts holding the cylinder on, and the 2 bolt only has 2. The 2 bolt engines have a tendency to blow out base gaskets. I run copper base gaskets on all mine, they base gaskets seem to blow out at the worst times. LOL. I haven't herd of a 4 bolt blowing out a base gasket yet.

I like the 27.2cc they are a machined 26cc cylinder machined to accept a 2mm stroked crank.

Also I am a fan of the 28.5cc it uses the stock stroke.

Hope that helps.

[mynameismud76]

Haha, should've phrased the 2 or 4 bolt question better (my mistake) but you've read my mind. I can see how 4 bolt would provide a stronger seal.

What's the 2mm stroked crank? And stuffed cranks? With what? Sage and onion? haha!

The info you've posted helps great deal, but seems like there are cans of worms jumping out from every direction! LOL

Appreciate yours and everyone's input though, good info!! :punk:

[Clubin]

Ok,

Stuffed crank has a epoxy like plasticky material filling all the voids in the crank, it decreases case volume and is a good thing. It is also more aerodynamic spinning in the case. Some have had issues with the stuffing coming out and messing things up-me for one. LOL

Stock
http://www.davesmotors.com/s.nl;jsessionid=0a0106431f43a71f405b66f64fdca75ccc f040f1d4ad.e3eSc3eMbxuPe34Pa38Ta38Tbx90?c=885035&sc=12&category=&search=dd304%20-%20CY%20/%20RC%2028mm%20Crankshaft

Stock stroke stuffed
http://www.davesmotors.com/s.nl/c.885035/n.1/it.A/id.1290/.f

Stroked crankshaft, a standard stroke is 28mm, a 30mm would be a +2mm srroke. The 2mm stroked crankshafts are used in the 30.5's 27.2's, and the cy 29cc.

the 27.2 uses a 34mm diameter cylinder machined in the combustion chamber for clearance of the additional stroke. The cylinders are a 26cc displacement - stock before the cylinder work is done.


the cy 29 has a cylinder diameter of 35mm and uses a +2 stroke

The 30.5 uses a 36mm diameter cylinder machined in the combustion chamber for clearance of the additional stroke. The cylinders are a 28.5cc displacement - stock before the cylinder work is done.

Any other questions? LOL THis otta throw a wrench into things for ya. LOL

[mynameismud76]

Haha. And I used to get lots of detentions and kicked out of classes!! Don't know why..LOL

Perfect!! Makes lots more sense now.

Cheers buddy =)

[highwaystar]

I thought I was undecided, but now I'm not so sure..:going insane:

Yup, shall give TMR a shout. Cheers =)

I am having TMR do a 4 bolt Dark Soul case with a 36mm Zen headkit, and a bunch of other "top "secret" voodoo on the inside. Al says it should be good for 2hp and .5 lbs tq!LOL I am not sure if I can handle that power. Al has been great to deal with. He has a wealth of knowledge. He also has a pretty strong following in the Go Ped world. The way i see it if he can make these motors move people, my little 5th scaler should fly!

[mynameismud76]

I see your logic there buddy.

I've emailed TMR, just awaiting his reply..

[highwaystar]

I see your logic there buddy.

I've emailed TMR, just awaiting his reply..

I know he is very busy playint catch up after his surgery. If I talk to him today I will send him your way.

[mynameismud76]

Thanks buddy =)

[mooman007uk]

one other thing with the new 4 bolts is they have better designed ports and more meat to work with apparently, this equates to being able to get more horsepower and reliability. whoever you end up buying from make sure you get the ceramic bearings...they definitely give more revs than stockers

[mynameismud76]

Mate, those bearings aren't cheap are they? LOL

http://www.bocabearings.com/main1.aspx?p=product&id=18578&n=*ENK-238C-HP

:omg:

[mooman007uk]

these are the ones you want...much nicer price
http://www.oneillbrothers.com/rccar/itemdescription/ceramic_bearings.htm

[mynameismud76]

Can't see the price Mooman =(

How much are they?

[mooman007uk]

http://www.oneillbrothers.com/rccar//rebuild_bottomend.htm

$40

[dc2 man]

CAD POWER all the way......


http://www.xandi-modellbau.de/

way too much fun trying to control.:gun bandana:

i hear a lot of good things about tmr.

i will also get an oddified this birthday i believe from a very nice girlfriend :punk:

the obr are great engines,i got a 27.2 stroker sitting on the shelf,a good engine.....

[mynameismud76]

Can't understand a damn thing on CAD site mate. =(

Psss! I've got one on the way!! With a Jetpro pipe also.. :punk:

[Clubin]

Can't understand a damn thing on CAD site mate. =(

Psss! I've got one on the way!! With a Jetpro pipe also.. :punk:
Funny!

CAD is not popular in North America, we hear very little about them. Lots of other very good companies though.

[mynameismud76]

Sorry, I've not ordered a CAD..my mistake, it wasn't very clear.

I've got a big box from OBR on the way :excited:

[Clubin]

Sorry, I've not ordered a CAD..my mistake, it wasn't very clear.

I've got a big box from OBR on the way :excited:

I know you went with ONB. Why wouldn't you have. LOL

[mynameismud76]

Have to put a cap on this impulse buying business.

The wife might skin my nutsack if I don't :omg:

[mooman007uk]

which OBR motor did you end up getting?

[mynameismud76]

It's the bigun 30cc full mod..with Jetpro pipe.. :omg:

Might need help in getting more traction..have a feeling it's just going to use more tyres than a F1 team does in a year..

Or diffs, or any other bits of the drivetrain..

[TMRperformance]

sorry i didnt get your email right away, its much easier to get me via pm... or by the telephone # on my site... since you already have your mill i wish you good luck with it, and if you ever need me you know how to find me...lol.

[mynameismud76]

Now I know =)

Thanks buddy, just sent you PM =)